0:00 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you for watching. 0:30 [SPEAKER_00]: In February of 2018, Gemma and I worked together to chase a promising lead after the keepers was released. 0:38 [SPEAKER_00]: What you are about to hear is a series of odd events that resulted in us trying to track down a box of what seemed to be very important evidence. 0:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Stick around to the very end to hear our conclusion. 0:51 [SPEAKER_02]: I am one of the grassroots investigators from the Keepers series. 0:56 [SPEAKER_02]: We actually did not do the investigation for the keepers. 0:59 [SPEAKER_02]: We were here and a half into it before Chi5 Media contacted us. 1:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Most of you have probably seen the series, if not, then encourage you to stay at the IO Center. 1:11 [SPEAKER_02]: And today I have some new information that I would like to put out to all of the listeners 1:20 [SPEAKER_02]: finding an individual. 1:22 [SPEAKER_02]: And I appreciate Shane Waters for allowing me to talk publicly about this. 1:31 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Jim Ahoskins. 1:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Most will remember her as one of the two ladies that spearheaded the amateur investigation into sister Kathy's murder. 1:47 [SPEAKER_02]: from a woman in Florida, a Facebook message, who said she had some information to share with me. 1:55 [SPEAKER_02]: And frankly, I get a lot of messages like that. 1:59 [SPEAKER_02]: So I didn't think a lot of it. 2:01 [SPEAKER_02]: However, when I probed a little bit, she said that she had never heard of Sister Kathy until this summer, when a friend of hers mentioned the documentary, 2:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We will be referring to the name given to Gemma during the first conversation by the caller as Jane the phone lady. 2:26 [SPEAKER_00]: This was a false name. 2:27 [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, it was another person's name. 2:29 [SPEAKER_02]: And we want to ensure that we protect her privacy. 2:46 [SPEAKER_02]: And the woman's name was Bernadeste Pana, C-O-N-O-R. 2:53 [SPEAKER_02]: They lived in live oak, Florida, which is a very small town of about 6,000 people. 3:02 [SPEAKER_02]: You'll have to Google that, so you can see where it is. 3:06 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me that Bernadette, a family because Jane, the phone lady, was taking care of her, didn't bother much with her. 3:16 [SPEAKER_02]: And when Bernadette had a stroke in 2006, I think that Jane, the phone lady, was the only person that really communicated with her. 3:29 [SPEAKER_02]: During that time, Bernadette shared she was aware of some information that was in her husband's belongings. 3:41 [SPEAKER_02]: They were divorced by that time that frightened her and told Jane the phone lady that she felt like she should have reported what she saw to the police, but she was afraid of her husband. 3:57 [SPEAKER_02]: So as this woman talked, I began to wonder, is this scam that she's going to ask me for money or is this the real deal? 4:07 [SPEAKER_02]: So I asked if I could call her. 4:10 [SPEAKER_02]: We got on the phone. 4:12 [SPEAKER_02]: We talked for an hour. 4:14 [SPEAKER_02]: She was totally sober, straight, credible, not crazy acting, like totally normal, speaking articulate adult. 4:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Jane the phone lady tells Jima that she is currently 29 years old. 4:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Her story starts out when she was 19, 10 years prior, in 2007. 4:36 [SPEAKER_00]: The lady she had been a caretaker for, burner data, passed away, leaving her with a box. 4:43 [SPEAKER_02]: The box is a cardboard file box with handles and a lid, like a paper box with day, 4:53 [SPEAKER_02]: She looked in the box that had her name on it. 4:56 [SPEAKER_02]: She went to the home and picked it up. 4:59 [SPEAKER_02]: And none of it made sense to her. 5:01 [SPEAKER_02]: She looked at her. 5:02 [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't recognize anything. 5:05 [SPEAKER_02]: So she put it in her father's garage where it stayed for 10 years. 5:12 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me that her father lived in Ocean City, Maryland. 5:16 [SPEAKER_02]: So 5:17 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm wondering who's the father, what's in the box. 5:21 [SPEAKER_02]: And I asked her if she could talk to me about the content. 5:26 [SPEAKER_02]: And this is what she told me was in the box. 5:29 [SPEAKER_02]: First of all, she said there was schoolbook in the box, which I said, that's not really relevant. 5:35 [SPEAKER_02]: And she said, they might be because there are lots of notes written. 5:39 [SPEAKER_02]: The spines are torn. 5:40 [SPEAKER_02]: Some of it is water damage. 5:42 [SPEAKER_02]: She thinks from being in her father's garage or shed. 5:46 [SPEAKER_02]: The books have places underlined and marked in margins. 5:52 [SPEAKER_02]: So I didn't think much of that. 5:54 [SPEAKER_00]: The lady explains that there are photographs of people that she does not recognize and documents from the archdiocese of Baltimore. 6:03 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me there were letters and the letters were written 6:14 [SPEAKER_02]: She also told me that there was a journal in the box. 6:18 [SPEAKER_02]: The journal is very interesting because this is where the name Kathy Sezhnik appeared over and over again. 6:27 [SPEAKER_02]: So during this past summer, when a friend told Jane the phone lady, that best of she has seen the keepers and mentioned Kathy says Nick, the name rang a bell to her. 6:39 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me she made him bed that night trying to figure out why she knew the name Kathy says Nick, and she suddenly remembered that it was in the journal that she had put away 10 years before. 6:55 [SPEAKER_02]: She picked up the box from her dad. 6:58 [SPEAKER_02]: She went back to Florida, and she got in touch with me. 7:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, I was writing things down. 7:07 [SPEAKER_02]: I was fascinated, but I still thought she could find all of this online at the library. 7:13 [SPEAKER_02]: And I was very sensitive about believing this whole story. 7:20 [SPEAKER_02]: So I asked more questions. 7:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I asked her what was in the journal. 7:25 [SPEAKER_02]: She said it's several different handwriting. 7:27 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not the same person. 7:29 [SPEAKER_02]: She asked me if the name Anthony meant anything. 7:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Anthony is Maskel's first name. 7:36 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's his brother Tommy's middle name. 7:40 [SPEAKER_02]: And Tommy was Maskel's half brother who with the high ranking police officer with Baltimore City. 7:47 [SPEAKER_02]: So with that, my interest was take a little more. 7:51 [SPEAKER_02]: She said, a lot of what's in the journal is unreadable because the water damage. 7:58 [SPEAKER_02]: I asked her if she could take a picture of what she had and she said, it's too much, too many things to take a picture of, she wanted me to have the box. 8:09 [SPEAKER_02]: So we continue talking. 8:11 [SPEAKER_02]: She also told me that in the box, 8:17 [SPEAKER_02]: And inside that was an old black grocery. 8:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Also a handwritten Bible verse. 8:27 [SPEAKER_02]: So let's start connecting some dots. 8:29 [SPEAKER_02]: I finally asked her what happened to Bernadette and her husband, a die, but she and her husband divorced. 8:38 [SPEAKER_02]: And I assumed his last name was Connor. 8:41 [SPEAKER_02]: I asked her what his name was, and she said, 8:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, this woman didn't present this information to me voluntarily. 8:51 [SPEAKER_02]: She didn't know I was going to ask that, but I thought that was significant. 8:57 [SPEAKER_02]: So we talked some more, and she told me that she had called the Baltimore County Police Department's twice, and did not talk to our codecase detectives, talked to somebody who went to the phone, 9:15 [SPEAKER_02]: She called again and was told someone and call her back and nobody ever did. 9:19 [SPEAKER_02]: She also told me she received a phone call in the last month, which would have been like August into September of 2017, from someone who was from a church, but would not give her their name. 9:36 [SPEAKER_02]: So she refused to talk to them, they wanted the box. 9:41 [SPEAKER_02]: In addition, she told me that in 2014, she was approached by the estate of Bernadetta. 9:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know who that would have been asking for the box. 9:55 [SPEAKER_02]: And they said she was not allowed to take it out of the home like she did. 10:00 [SPEAKER_02]: However, an attorney advised her, and she would be able to keep the box because it had her name on the top of it, written on the top of it. 10:10 [SPEAKER_02]: And that made it her. 10:13 [SPEAKER_02]: So moving one, I advised her that if she would ship me the box, I gave her my address. 10:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I have two addresses. 10:24 [SPEAKER_02]: I gave her both of them. 10:25 [SPEAKER_02]: I took a risk and said that I would reimburse her for whatever cost to send it to me. 10:32 [SPEAKER_02]: She did not ask me for any money. 10:34 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me she had her father's credit card and she would go to the post office in the morning and she would strip the box to me because he said he only wanted me to have it that she wouldn't let anybody else have it. 10:49 [SPEAKER_02]: So with that we hung up in the middle of the night my phone panged and it was a message from her saying I'm really sorry I don't want to do this anymore. 11:03 [SPEAKER_02]: So, of course, I didn't sleep much. 11:05 [SPEAKER_02]: In the morning, I tried to respond by Facebook messenger, asking her to contact me all day long, nothing. 11:14 [SPEAKER_02]: In the evening, I got a message from another woman, telling me that the young woman you spoke to last night, told my phone, she's a drug addict. 11:32 [SPEAKER_02]: She has a box, but she stole my phone and didn't need to forget what ever she told you. 11:42 [SPEAKER_02]: So I asked Ms. Women. 11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: life can get overwhelming, and talking to someone can make all the difference. 11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Better help, the sponsor of this episode, make starting therapy simple. 11:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Complete a short questionnaire and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist, and as little as a couple of days, you can connect by message, phone, or video, from wherever you feel comfortable. 12:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And if the first therapist 12:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Better help include a journal for personal reflection and daily group sessions on a variety of topics and they accept each essay and FSA cards. 12:25 [SPEAKER_00]: with over 2,000,000 users, and a 4-point star rating on trust pilot. 12:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Better help is a trusted platform for accessible mental health care. 12:35 [SPEAKER_00]: If you think you could benefit from therapy, visit betterhelp.com, choose our podcast during sign-up, and get 10% off your first month. 12:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Taking care of your mental health is a sign of strength. 12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Start your journey today. 12:52 [SPEAKER_02]: If I can call her, she said, yeah, this is why I'm calling this woman Jane the phone lady because her name did that was actually showing up when this other young woman called me. 13:07 [SPEAKER_02]: That was a very different voice, a very strong Southern accent. 13:16 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me that 13:17 [SPEAKER_02]: The girl with the box is named Kelly K. E. L. Y. I think, and that we're going to call Kelly the box girl, she's the one I actually spoke to who told me what was in the box. 13:32 [SPEAKER_02]: So now we're going to get forget about day in the phone lady. 13:35 [SPEAKER_02]: She's not going to be involved anymore because it was just her phone was stolen, but she does tell me that. 13:43 [SPEAKER_02]: Kelly's brother whose name is Roger, I believe his last name is Dylan, but there are many spellings of that found his sister at the post office in the morning trying to ship the box to me. 13:59 [SPEAKER_02]: When she saw him, she got mad. 14:02 [SPEAKER_02]: She took off one foot, went to the box, and threw a book 14:12 [SPEAKER_02]: And back to the phone lady, who's not going to be named, told me that on the front of the book, what a distant gold Saint Clement Parrish. 14:27 [SPEAKER_02]: It was up. 14:28 [SPEAKER_02]: It's off cover Bible from St. Clement, which is the church where Moscow lived as pastor and where a great deal of the abuse happened. 14:42 [SPEAKER_02]: So because Kelly never told me about this book with that on the front. 14:47 [SPEAKER_02]: And the phone lady and the brother would have had no reason to know, say, Clement unless the whole town is scanning us, which I don't think it is. 14:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Now he has the Bible. 15:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I asked the phone lady if she could get it. 15:02 [SPEAKER_02]: She said, yes, he won't give a tour. 15:05 [SPEAKER_02]: I guess he knows that there's some value to it. 15:08 [SPEAKER_02]: No one has to approach me to ask me for money. 15:12 [SPEAKER_02]: I would love to have that Bible because that would tell me if everything else is true. 15:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Kelly, that's the post office, took off one foot, the next thing I hear is that she goes to her boyfriend's mother's home asking for a shovel. 15:29 [SPEAKER_02]: She varies the during box, okay, in somebody's backyard. 15:33 [SPEAKER_02]: I hear nothing for a week. 15:37 [SPEAKER_02]: Then I hear that from the phone lady, she's dug up, somebody's backyard looking for the box. 15:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, we have to understand that Kelly has some addiction problems, but I believe she's trying to do the right thing. 15:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I believe she has the box, other of the phone lady and the brother said she's obsessed with the box. 16:00 [SPEAKER_02]: She takes it everywhere with her. 16:03 [SPEAKER_02]: She gave her brother my name and phone number. 16:07 [SPEAKER_02]: And he responded that, I think he said, you're both crazy. 16:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know who this lady is. 16:13 [SPEAKER_02]: So I would love to talk to the brother. 16:15 [SPEAKER_02]: I believe the father who lives in Maryland, I think, the code is in the ocean city. 16:23 [SPEAKER_02]: It's all their name, Roger Gillen. 16:26 [SPEAKER_02]: I have personally contacted every person in Ocean City with every spelling of the last name Dylan that I could find on Facebook. 16:37 [SPEAKER_02]: None of them were related to this Roger. 16:42 [SPEAKER_02]: I also bought a subscription to Truth finder for two months, so I could get the background information on 16:55 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know the spelling of Dylan. 16:58 [SPEAKER_02]: It could be, phone lady said she thought it was D-I-L-I-O-N or D-I-L-O-N. 17:07 [SPEAKER_02]: But it couldn't be, D-I-D-I-L-A-N. 17:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Phone lady also told me that L-D-I-D has been Natalie several times. 17:17 [SPEAKER_02]: And I know that's accurate because the evening we were talking, 17:23 [SPEAKER_02]: L. E. F. Cone Lady was picking up her daughter in the car. 17:28 [SPEAKER_02]: I can hear her talking to her daughter. 17:30 [SPEAKER_02]: She was picking her up and taking her half the whole kind of day she had, but apparently the dad has custody and we're not going to win Bob a child in this. 17:40 [SPEAKER_02]: We just need to stay the box. 17:43 [SPEAKER_02]: So. 17:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I started on the thing from, okay, I started on this information for a while trying to do my own research not wanting to involve a lot of people come to find out a Facebook friend lived outside of LIVOC and is there often by gotten tests with her and she said she would ask around town. 18:07 [SPEAKER_02]: I finally called our cold case detective in Baltimore County and told them what I knew. 18:15 [SPEAKER_02]: I share with the police credible lead and our detective officer agreed with me that it was worth pursuing. 18:25 [SPEAKER_02]: So all this time I'm hearing nothing. 18:29 [SPEAKER_02]: I tried to get in touch with 18:32 [SPEAKER_02]: phone lady one more time, and I was not able to. 18:36 [SPEAKER_02]: Her voice mail is not set up, which is not a bad thing to do if you don't want people bothering you. 18:43 [SPEAKER_02]: So, I finally got in touch with her, called me, she asked me to speak to the 18:54 [SPEAKER_02]: that the people in the town were glass that Kelly was gone, apparently Kelly dug up the box and hitchhiked to North Carolina trying to get to me. 19:06 [SPEAKER_02]: So a friend in Maryland was supposed to pick her up in North Carolina and bring her back to Maryland. 19:15 [SPEAKER_02]: I have no idea if that actually happened. 19:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Bung Lady told me the people in town would love to see her go where her folks are up north because she needs help and they were hoping she would get help. 19:34 [SPEAKER_02]: So, for all I know, Bugs may be in the father's garage again, but I can't find him. 19:41 [SPEAKER_02]: So, I talked to our officers at the Baltimore County. 19:54 [SPEAKER_02]: with the day after Thanksgiving and this is funny because the police department was actually closed for the holidays so I don't know what would happen if you had an emergency anyway. 20:06 [SPEAKER_02]: She left a message. 20:08 [SPEAKER_02]: I talked to our officer the next week. 20:10 [SPEAKER_02]: She told me that the officer she spoke to did not know who can we maybe she just talked to the wrong person 20:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Or if you're traipsing around town with a box that probably people know who you are. 20:29 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's been a dead end. 20:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I have written a letter. 20:36 [SPEAKER_02]: to the county offices asking how I would look for a person. 20:43 [SPEAKER_02]: And I was given the address for the sheriff, which is probably a better bet than the police department, unless there's the same thing. 20:52 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. 20:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I wrote a detailed letter to the sheriff, and I had not heard back from him. 20:58 [SPEAKER_02]: I also looked online so that these are some things you all are thinking about, you can pursue it with me. 21:06 [SPEAKER_02]: I looked online for any Facebook pages that had to do with my vote Florida. 21:12 [SPEAKER_02]: For example, real estate. 21:15 [SPEAKER_02]: There was also a yard sale page. 21:18 [SPEAKER_02]: I thought that would be a good place to put a missing person at the time. 21:23 [SPEAKER_02]: Which I did at any time for this. 21:26 [SPEAKER_02]: And I've gotten no results, but I actually can't find my post on that page. 21:31 [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't know what happened to that. 21:33 [SPEAKER_02]: This is why we need your help, guys. 21:36 [SPEAKER_02]: And we don't want anybody to get arrested. 21:40 [SPEAKER_02]: Please do not start breaking around my vote. 21:45 [SPEAKER_02]: bothering people that don't want to be bothered, but anybody that can do research for me, or has any connections with that town, or can use whatever resources they have. 21:59 [SPEAKER_02]: We're looking for Kelly. 22:01 [SPEAKER_02]: She trusts me. 22:02 [SPEAKER_02]: She only wants me to have the box. 22:05 [SPEAKER_02]: She refuses to give it to anybody else, and I believe that she's trying to do the right thing. 22:14 [SPEAKER_02]: If there's evidence in this box that's incriminating, of course, the police are going to get it. 22:19 [SPEAKER_02]: I told our officer if a box shows up at my house. 22:24 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to put gloves on. 22:26 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to film it. 22:28 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to have two friends there as witness says, and we're going to look at everything. 22:32 [SPEAKER_02]: And then we're going to call the police and they can come and pick it up. 22:36 [SPEAKER_02]: She totally understood. 22:37 [SPEAKER_02]: She laughed. 22:39 [SPEAKER_02]: She said, I'm not getting anywhere with that. 22:42 [SPEAKER_02]: And she said, we have a whole lot more on this case that we're working on. 22:46 [SPEAKER_02]: She said, good luck. 22:47 [SPEAKER_02]: I hope you find something. 22:50 [SPEAKER_02]: So everything I've told you today. 22:54 [SPEAKER_02]: The officers in the Baltimore County Code Case Department know about it. 23:00 [SPEAKER_02]: And so there's nothing I'm hiding. 23:03 [SPEAKER_02]: I know a lot of you have been wondering. 23:05 [SPEAKER_02]: I know a lot of people that are related to Edgar Davis then are probably anxious, but I feel like this is the right thing to do. 23:14 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm hoping that's being public about it is making me safer. 23:19 [SPEAKER_02]: And Ken Garner some support from you because I really feel like this could help. 23:26 [SPEAKER_02]: with Mr. Kathy's mother case. 23:29 [SPEAKER_02]: I thought very connected to this young woman. 23:31 [SPEAKER_02]: I think she's troubled. 23:33 [SPEAKER_02]: She was not, she was totally sober when I was talking. 23:35 [SPEAKER_02]: No. 23:36 [SPEAKER_02]: There was no evidence of anything out of the ordinary. 23:40 [SPEAKER_02]: So I feel very badly that she has addiction problems. 23:45 [SPEAKER_02]: I understand that 23:46 [SPEAKER_02]: There is a lot of drug addiction in this town. 23:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know that. 23:52 [SPEAKER_02]: One thing I can add is that she was at one time living on a piece of property that could boyfriend mother owned and that they were in a trailer and the trailer was repossessed. 24:05 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know who the boyfriend is or if he's in the picture anymore. 24:09 [SPEAKER_02]: If anybody down there knows who he is, I would love for them to respond to us, if this is really critical information, you go ahead and send it to my Facebook messenger, but I have to be honest with you, I can't accept any friend requests, okay, on life I know like a whole bunch of people that we both know, so please do not. 24:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Try to print me. 24:33 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just is not safe and it's just getting really unwieldy. 24:37 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to prefer that you do this through Shane. 24:40 [SPEAKER_02]: I hope that maybe Kelly's listening. 24:43 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the phone lady is listening. 24:45 [SPEAKER_02]: I promise I will never contact you again. 24:49 [SPEAKER_02]: I know the police contacted her and she told them I was harassing her. 24:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I'll be honest about that, but I was asking questions and I guess everybody got a little spoofed because I don't know who knows what down there. 25:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, let's see if we can find out about what's in this box and then we can move towards a solution. 25:29 [SPEAKER_00]: two weeks ago, you heard from Gemma Hoskins. 25:32 [SPEAKER_00]: The grassroots amateur detective and retired teacher featured in the Netflix Docu series titled The Keepers. 25:40 [SPEAKER_00]: We wanted to update you on what has happened with the investigation over the last two weeks since that episode aired. 25:47 [SPEAKER_00]: We now know the truth of the where, why, and how. 25:52 [SPEAKER_00]: After releasing the podcast, I got in touch with Jane the phone lady, knowing that she had already asked us not to contact her. 26:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Things just were not adding up because this lady named Kelly just didn't seem like a real name, at least with the information that we had. 26:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Jane, who again is not her real name, agreed to speak to me so we spoke for about 30 minutes on the phone, and she again walked me through the events when Kelly contacted Jimma. 26:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll remember that Kelly had Jane's phone, and first reached out to Jimma from Kelly's Facebook. 26:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I pressed Jane on how Kelly could access her smartphone, and Facebook, and after a while I dug around enough to get the name of another party to verify that Kelly was a real person. 26:42 [SPEAKER_00]: This conversation with Jane struck me as she was telling the truth. 26:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything lined up with what she had told us before. 26:52 [SPEAKER_00]: When you are talking to someone, it's important to have them go over their story again later. 26:57 [SPEAKER_00]: You can catch someone in a lie, simply because the truth is easy to remember, but a lie will come out in many different variations with time. 27:08 [SPEAKER_00]: My conclusion was Jane is telling the truth. 27:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Kelly is who we need to find. 27:14 [SPEAKER_00]: There was one part that didn't make sense to me however. 27:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Jane told me she had been contacted by many people, including news outlet, which is why she felt she was being harassed. 27:27 [SPEAKER_00]: This didn't make sense to me because the only people who knew her identity in phone number was Gemma, myself, and the detective. 27:37 [SPEAKER_00]: But why would she be lying about this small detail? 27:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Remember this for later? 27:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Something Jane told me was the name of someone who could confirm that Kelly was real. 27:48 [SPEAKER_00]: This is important to do when verifying what you are being told. 27:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Someone else who can cooperate not only Jane's story, but someone who may have more information on who Kelly is. 28:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Up until this time, the information we had about her wasn't enough to track her down. 28:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Jane told me about Kelly's boyfriend, and how he has an ex-wife who knows about Kelly. 28:16 [SPEAKER_00]: After speaking to Jane, I found the ex-wife on Facebook, and I sent her a message. 28:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Her name is Jessica. 28:23 [SPEAKER_00]: She lives several states away from Florida, where all of this took place. 28:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Jessica had no idea about our search, so I knew getting a message from me, and the story I had was going to seem like something out of a science fiction novel. 28:39 [SPEAKER_00]: But she agreed to speak with me on the phone. 28:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Jessica is a very well-spoken person, and although she was confused on why I was contacting her, she was very cooperative and open. 28:52 [SPEAKER_00]: She explained that yes, Kelly is a real person who has had a few last names. 28:58 [SPEAKER_00]: She was able to confirm the character behind Kelly, and with her real last name, I was able to find Kelly's arrest record. 29:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Kelly had been arrested numerous times in Florida, and last year she was arrested for possession of drugs and a few counts of trespassing. 29:23 [SPEAKER_00]: With this, I found Kelly. 29:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So Jima reached out and we were in for a surprise. 29:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Kelly painted a picture that she was a victim because she had no involvement in any of this. 29:38 [SPEAKER_00]: She said she was never in that area of Florida when the call was made and that she had no knowledge of a box. 29:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Ellie pointed her finger towards Jessica and Jane as creating this entire story 29:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Did you pick up on that first inconsistency here with Kelly's story? 29:59 [SPEAKER_00]: She said she was never in that area of Florida during the time. 30:04 [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, she told us she was several states away, our rest records do not lie. 30:09 [SPEAKER_00]: She was definitely in the area and she was definitely arrested. 30:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So now Gemma and I know we are being lied too, but from who? 30:18 [SPEAKER_00]: No one has anything to gain from this, there is no money involved. 30:23 [SPEAKER_00]: We found Kelly, but now we are left with more questions than answers. 30:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Why is Kelly lying about being in Florida? 30:32 [SPEAKER_00]: And why would Jessica and Jane frame Kelly? 30:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Why did Jane say she was contacted by other media outlets and people? 30:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Here is what truly happened. 30:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Shortly before Jimma is contacted about a box, Kelly and her boyfriend get into a violent argument. 30:52 [SPEAKER_00]: The boyfriend goes to jail, and Kelly is living in a small shed. 30:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Fearing for Kelly's safety and livelihood, Jane asks the police to do a wellness check. 31:04 [SPEAKER_00]: While checking on her, the police realized that Kelly did not have permission to be living in the shed, so she is arrested for trespassing. 31:13 [SPEAKER_00]: A few days later, Kelly doesn't have a place to go, so Jane drops her off at a bar where Kelly kept Jane's phone while searching for a place that she can stay. 31:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Here she meets up with a few friends. 31:28 [SPEAKER_00]: This group of friends decide to pay Jane back for Kelly's trespassing arrest. 31:33 [SPEAKER_00]: They contact a few news outlets from James Facebook on her phone, saying she has information about cases. 31:41 [SPEAKER_00]: One of these people that she contacts is Gemma. 31:46 [SPEAKER_00]: We found out that one of the women in the group has an obsession with the keeper series and went even as far to research information about this case at the library. 31:59 [SPEAKER_00]: So, when Gemma speaks to one of them on the phone, the others in the group are able to search and feed her information, enough that Gemma believed them. 32:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Now everything makes sense. 32:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Jane was receiving phone calls and messages for many sources because of the other cases, the group sent messages about. 32:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Kelly was involved and it was all just a scheme to pay Jane back for her wellness check. 32:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Gemma is a very intelligent person, it took a group of people with knowledge from the series combined with research from the library and a few phones with Google and a few coincidences like Ed Remaring and Florida to make her believe it. 32:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Here is Gemma. 32:51 [SPEAKER_01]: First of all, I'm going to thank Shane for all the time and effort that he has put into this. 32:57 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been quite an interesting route and I just want to share my reflections about where I've learned from this period and hope that you'll think about what you've learned from it because we want you to share your lesson plans. 33:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I learned that I can't be too and yeah, I know I'm a smart person, I'm going to put 33:22 [SPEAKER_01]: They put a really elaborate story together, and I believe it, and it was not until I heard that it was made up, that I was convinced it was made up. 33:34 [SPEAKER_01]: The other thing is that don't keep your address to people. 33:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't get your phone number of people unless somebody that you do. 33:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Can you think some other way, I guess, like Facebook or whatever? 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, I also have learned that also are wonderful people. 33:50 [SPEAKER_01]: The whole world went to that for me on trying to find the answers to this puzzle. 33:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm very sorry for all the time. 34:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And effort you put into it for all the research you did. 34:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I know for some of you it was monetarily effective. 34:08 [SPEAKER_01]: others, put their heart to talk, made their kids get young, so that they just stay on their computer. 34:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And I want you to know how much I appreciate that. 34:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm really sorry that we didn't get in closer. 34:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And I will assure you that before any first of all, we're working this page Bill tonight. 34:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think I'm going to get the answers that we want. 34:29 [SPEAKER_01]: But for now, I would really love if you would respond to Shane's podcast. 34:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe you on the keeper's 34:36 [SPEAKER_01]: by tearing the lessons you learned and your reflections during this whole experience. 34:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you, Humbhjama. 34:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So there you have it. 34:45 [SPEAKER_00]: The Who, the Why, in the How? 34:48 [SPEAKER_00]: The last post I made on my true crime blog titled My Journey Into Darkness. 34:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I wrote about a couple weeks ago when I said an awaiting room at a hospital while my mother's battle for her health is playing out. 35:02 [SPEAKER_00]: My mom's sufferers from multiple sclerosis. 35:06 [SPEAKER_00]: and that day she was undergoing a four-hour surgery for a newly found tumor to be removed around her spine. 35:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I spoke about how in every situation it's important to reflect on what lesson you can learn. 35:20 [SPEAKER_00]: At that time, I learned that my mom's strength and always caring on no matter what obstacle comes her way reminds me that strength doesn't always mean winning. 35:31 [SPEAKER_00]: It just means that you never 35:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Gemma never gave up when she felt there may be truth behind this box of evidence. 35:39 [SPEAKER_00]: It took a group of people with arguably too much time on their hands to fool her. 35:45 [SPEAKER_00]: But she isn't the loser here. 35:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Gemma is a woman on a mission. 35:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Her role model and teacher was brutally murdered many years ago and that murder is still unsolved. 35:57 [SPEAKER_00]: No matter what mountain is thrown her way, she will continue to find the strength to keep on, keeping on. 36:04 [SPEAKER_00]: For those out there with her own struggle, I hope that you can take away from this your own lesson. 36:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Strength isn't winning, it's never giving up, so never give up. 36:30 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you. 37:01 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
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