0:04 [SPEAKER_00]: In my opinion, the single best online resource for visiting American National Parks were even appreciating them from afar. 0:13 [SPEAKER_00]: As a site called more than just parks, you can find it at more than just parks.com. 0:19 [SPEAKER_00]: This site is run by two brothers, Will and Jim Patties, who will be joining us today. 0:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I found more than just parks while researching for our podcast trip out west, and their site is a difting, and a good way. 0:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Their videos have been called, the most beautiful videos of America you'll ever watch. 0:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Will and Gemma have been profiled by everyone from National Geographic and the Weather Channel to the today show that I'm grateful to have them on. 0:46 [SPEAKER_00]: They have contagious enthusiasm for the National Park Service. 0:50 [SPEAKER_00]: They also have, at least for my perspective, one of the best jobs in the world. 0:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a pretty neat job. 0:57 [SPEAKER_01]: It gets us out to some really amazing places. 1:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It was a lot of trial and error in the beginning trying to figure out how we could make a career out of this because a lot of people ask us, well how do you get that job? 1:08 [SPEAKER_01]: What didn't exist? 1:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not like I went to LinkedIn and looked for an application. 1:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, we just started making films on these places that really matter to us. 1:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to invite Will and Jim to share some of their insights on the parks, but I also wanted to hear more about how they came to develop what is arguably the best national park resource on the web. 1:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we all packed up our car and we've got some kind of comical photos of this, but imagine we take our grandmothers' pre-institut time, just crammed the back of it full with bags, so much stuff. 2:02 [SPEAKER_01]: You never be able to use that much stuff. 2:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And we take it all across the country and along the way to the Grand Canyon, we stopped off at an national park called Petrified Forest in Arizona and just completely blew our minds. 2:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Coming from the East Coast, your sense of nature is different than the West Coast, whereas on the East Coast, spit more intimate on the West Coast, its grand landscapes, massive things. 2:26 [SPEAKER_01]: We are looking at a striped blue mesa and petroglyphs from hundreds of years ago, maybe thousands of them. 2:34 [SPEAKER_01]: There's like this lightning storm, there's a rainbow, it looks almost biblical, and we say to ourselves, wow, how have we never been 2:43 [SPEAKER_01]: to a place like this before. 2:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And then we had a horrible time at the Cancanyan. 2:48 [SPEAKER_01]: We decided to hike down to the bottom. 2:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We've been off a lot more than we could chew at the Grand Canyon at the touch, but we made it out and we said to ourselves after that. 2:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing that we've never been to a place like this before. 3:01 [SPEAKER_01]: How many other people are out there like us who have never experienced a national park? 3:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And then we said, what can we do to inform and educate folks to visit these places responsibly? 3:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we started more than this park, which is basically just a film-based project. 3:17 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll also grate online resources, creating really nice films on the national park. 3:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And since then, we've expanded to public lands in general and it's about the national parks and the forests and all of those protected areas where people can go and have these amazing experiences and like we'll say that's really what it's been about for us so that more people can have the experience that we had because there are so many people out there who haven't had the opportunity to get out there and it truly can be life changing but we just want people to know about them and maybe we can encourage them to go and visit once. 3:50 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the most important figures in the history of the National Parks is Teddy Roosevelt, who founded the United States Forest Service, and launched five new national parks between 1901 and 1909, more than doubling the size of the existing National Park Service. 4:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I asked Jim and Will, what had allowed Roosevelt to make conservation such as central part of his agenda? 4:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Theodore Roosevelt, he was grew up in a very Patricia and family in New York. 4:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think he had opportunities to interact with the natural world in a very safe and forgiving environment as a young boy. 4:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think probably the biggest thing for him was he always had a sense of wanting to give back and things like that a sense of public service. 4:38 [SPEAKER_01]: That was very much ingrained in his family. 4:41 [SPEAKER_01]: but I think the turning point for him was his wife dies and he experiences this great tragedy in his life and he decides to go out west to the Dakotas and because he just needs to get away from it all. 4:57 [SPEAKER_01]: He ends up going out there, and the bison are still out there. 5:01 [SPEAKER_01]: They've been kind of their numbers have been really decimated quite a bit. 5:04 [SPEAKER_01]: But he goes out there and he sees these incredible landscapes. 5:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And he just falls in love with the west and with the fact that these places exist out there. 5:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it was really a transformative period in his life and he decides to at that time it was what was known as the open range out west. 5:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they were running cattle and then they were just kind of 5:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas today you have branches in the cattle are all kind of fenced in and so forth. 5:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Back then, you'd have great big herds of cattle being run all over the western United States. 5:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And all you did was brand them. 5:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's how you knew which cows were yours and which cows were somebody else's. 5:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And anyway, he decided to get into that lost a lot of money in that business. 5:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And Buddy loved the area and the experiences that he had out there. 5:53 [SPEAKER_01]: There are some amazing stories about his experiences out west. 5:58 [SPEAKER_01]: One of my favorites is when he goes out and he's determined he's through to Roosevelt as a big hunter and he's so he always wanted to get a bison. 6:06 [SPEAKER_01]: He always wanted to find a bison and hunt one. 6:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he goes out with this guy who knows the area. 6:13 [SPEAKER_01]: This was early on in his time in North Dakota. 6:16 [SPEAKER_01]: They go out on this track into the badlands, on their horses and so forth and they're trying to find bison and they can't find them for days and days and the weather is really nasty and at one point they set up camp for the night and they sleep out under the stars and it starts pouring rain in the night and then the rain turns to sleep. 6:37 [SPEAKER_01]: and they're just getting absolutely just downcore on them. 6:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And the guide who is with you to Roosevelt looks over at him. 6:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And he is smiling from ear to ear. 6:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And he says, by God free, but this is fun. 6:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's who he was. 6:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He just, it didn't matter. 6:57 [SPEAKER_01]: He just loved those landscapes and as he put it, the Strenuous life. 7:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that's where his love and appreciation of nature came from. 7:06 [SPEAKER_01]: What's that experience? 7:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And then, of course, he turned that into action when he became president. 7:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It was dead set on preserving as much of those incredible spaces as he could. 7:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, and the added that I would say that both of the Roosevelt's though were considered traders to their class, to an extent, whereas theodore Roosevelt, it was in a different sense than with Franklin Roosevelt because Franklin Roosevelt, what's interesting is people know theodore Roosevelt is 7:34 [SPEAKER_01]: people are hurting him as one of the greatest, maybe the greatest conservation president. 7:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But I would say that Franklin Roosevelt's achievements often go way under the radar, because the arose about started the Forest Service, U.S. Forest Service, he started the U.S. 7:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Fish and Wildlife System. 7:51 [SPEAKER_01]: These happened under the Theodore Roosevelt, but Franklin Roosevelt immensely expanded them. 7:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you hadn't had, like the amount of federal wildlife reserves in America, 8:02 [SPEAKER_01]: just exploded to this grid where Franklin Roosevelt was dead set on birds being able to land at different places all across the country. 8:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And so the federal wildlife refuge system that we have today is largely because of Franklin Roosevelt's work, speaking to your point earlier, soil conservation was a massive program that he undertook and that he knew firsthand because he had his own experimental forest. 8:29 [SPEAKER_01]: in New York, where he tried things out himself. 8:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he knew about these things firsthand. 8:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He would try them both of them, but from different angles. 8:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think to sum it up, and then basically Franklin Roosevelt's conservation, somewhat dipped for a time. 8:45 [SPEAKER_01]: We had LBJ had some great conservation achievements, but not really until Carter, who those are the three names that really need to come up in any conservation discussion in America. 8:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I think from Gemini's standpoint, the actual greatest conservation president was Carter, but you could make the case for any three of them and all their achievements were incredible. 9:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Interestingly, the Roosevelt Presidents shared more than a last name. 9:13 [SPEAKER_00]: They shared a hobby that helped cultivate their love of nature. 9:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I would just add another thing about the Roosevelt's about FDR and theater Roosevelt is they were actually both avid burders from a very young age and that's something that a lot of people don't know about and that was their earliest introduction to the natural world was through birding they were obsessed. 9:36 [SPEAKER_01]: with birds, and FDR was actually quite an expert on birds, and he actually trained under Audibon, and some of the really great onathologists, and FDR, the Museum of Natural History in Washington, DC, a large portion of their bird collection, is actually from FDR collecting bird specimens as a 10:04 [SPEAKER_01]: who was going out and he would collect specimens and his preservation techniques were so good and his knowledge of the birds were was so extensive that the Museum of Natural History in D.C. and in New York were accepting these 10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: and he did spill to this day. 10:23 [SPEAKER_01]: You can see birds that very young FDR was collecting and not because he was famous because he was not famous at the time. 10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It was purely because he was so well regarded in that field. 10:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So both of them have always had an affinity for animals and the natural world, I think, and that certainly had a lot to do with what they did as president. 10:43 [SPEAKER_00]: This connection with Burting makes a lot of sense to me. 10:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Unlike Hunter's or fishermen, Burters don't bring anything home with them. 10:50 [SPEAKER_00]: They simply observe and appreciate. 10:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Both in nature and communicating with it. 10:56 [SPEAKER_00]: On some level, is the Soul Objective. 10:58 [SPEAKER_00]: The sensibilities of the murder are the same sensibilities of the conservationist, the point is to view it, participate in it, and to walk away, leaving as little trace of your own presence as possible, so who better than a couple of murders to drive America's early conservation efforts? 11:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I have had an affinity for birds since I was a kid. 11:19 [SPEAKER_01]: We will and I grew up in a peedmont region of Georgia. 11:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So there's really incredible song birds there is to go out into the backyard and take note of the different ones that we're there. 11:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I've always just loved observing them I do to this day. 11:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And just to your point, I think it really does. 11:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's that sort of you're going there to see them, not to disturb anything. 11:40 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just it's such a respectful thing because you have an affinity for these creatures. 11:46 [SPEAKER_01]: observe them in their natural state. 11:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's really what national parks are. 11:51 [SPEAKER_01]: It's about experiencing this place and seeing it in its natural state. 11:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's so I do think it really translates really well. 11:59 [SPEAKER_01]: One story about Theodore Roosevelt that I always love is when he was president at the White House he would the groundskeepers 12:07 [SPEAKER_01]: were often very confused by him because sometimes he had been known to go outside and he would stand under a great big oak tree and he would stand completely still would not move for more than two hours just watching birds come in and out of the tree that's sitting U.S. President would walk out onto the front lawn of the White House 12:33 [SPEAKER_01]: and stand completely still for two hours or more, just observing birds and that shows you the deep passion that he had for wildlife and the natural world. 12:45 [SPEAKER_01]: That frankly, I would say, since Carter, we just haven't seen you've had presidents who have done great things, but none who have had that deep passion for the natural world. 12:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think we've seen that a long time. 12:58 [SPEAKER_00]: While I was somewhat familiar with the conservation work of the Roosevelt, I had no idea that Jimmy Carter had potentially outdone both of them in one short for a year presidency. 13:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Being from Carter's home state of Georgia, Jim and Will were both more familiar with our 39th President's legacy, and have since come to view him as one of the more underappreciated figures in American history. 13:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Jim and I could touch about Jimmy Carter all day, but he single-handedly doubled the size of the national park system, triple the size of the national, while on scenic rivers, let's go on, but very important, take your in conservation history. 13:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It is an overlook story, a very overlook story. 13:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Will and I have been fascinated by it for some time. 13:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But basically, I think it can be explained to twofold as the Carter comes in as president and the country is facing an energy crisis right away. 13:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the same time, inflation is also becoming a real problem as we're seeing today. 13:58 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's all over the world. 13:58 [SPEAKER_01]: This is seeing both of these are starting to sound quite familiar. 14:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, the Carter has to try and figure out a way to tackle inflation and this energy crisis, but you also have to remember that Carter is a conservationist. 14:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he's getting a lot of people are saying, we've got a drill, we've got to have more coal, we've got to have all these different things and you've got to do away with regulations on everything and Carter, 14:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't really do that, and another thing that is happening is that Carter was kind of people in Washington did not like him. 14:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And because he was this Georgia guy and he was not a DC politician by any means. 14:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And one of the things that he did early on was he actually vetoed a bunch of damn projects. 14:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Because he was like well touched on earlier, really the first president to understand that dams were actually not a good thing for the environment. 14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: and he was probably, I think, of any U.S. president, he was the biggest champion of what's known as wild rivers. 15:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Carter loves wild rivers and keeping rivers in their pristine wild state and there are so few rivers left in the United States that are actually preserved in their natural state. 15:16 [SPEAKER_01]: and they're part of what's known as the wild and scenic rivers system and Carter expanded that greatly under his presidency. 15:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, he angered a lot of people in his own party by vetoing these water projects, these dams that we're going to bring. 15:31 [SPEAKER_01]: a lot of money and a lot of jobs to different districts and things like that. 15:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the same time, Alaska for decades, politicians in DC have been trying to figure out what to do with a lot of these huge tracks of land in Alaska. 15:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And you have a lot of interests like mining and oil interests and of course logging interests who are wanting to make these tracks have them made available to them 16:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, to stress the backdrop of an energy crisis. 16:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, and Carter is dead set against allowing that he wants to preserve these places and so basically long story short is a lot of things don't go Carter's way in the sense that he's fighting of an uphill battle and he's swimming against the current and Carter decides to preserve this land in Alaska very politically unpopular thing to do he vetoes water projects very unpopular thing to do he doesn't 16:31 [SPEAKER_01]: go far enough to deregulate energy and things like that, which was also unpopular, and then of course you had the Iran hostage crisis and things like that. 16:41 [SPEAKER_01]: That were completely beyond his control. 16:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But the crazy thing is that Carter had actually, he appointed Paul Volker, who got inflation under control. 16:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And he had actually put in the solutions to all these problems that then his successor Ronald Reagan got the credit for. 16:58 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's a really overlooked story, but Carter basically said, I'm going to do the right thing, even though it's going to, his advisors were telling it. 17:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's going to cost you. 17:08 [SPEAKER_01]: This is, we're not going to get reelected if you do this. 17:11 [SPEAKER_01]: But he was saying, he said, no, I'm going to do the right thing, regardless. 17:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And he paid the price. 17:17 [SPEAKER_01]: we don't have leaders to do that anymore who will say that who are willing to forego a second term if that's what's necessary or a Carter hoped that he would be rewarded for his actions and that wasn't a case but now everybody tries to learn the lesson from Carter and say oh you've got to be worried about reelection you've got to 17:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's interesting because from I would say our perspective, the true lessons to learn from Carter are the far side in this, not just on the public lands, but also use the first president that was really concerned with renewable energies, famously put solar panels on the roof of the White House, invested over a billion dollars into solar initiatives with energy efficiency, he put in place that the fleet standards for automobiles and correct me if I'm wrong in this one. 18:06 [SPEAKER_01]: By 1995 he had put in fuel emissions standards so that by 1995 the fleet average for car manufacturers the fleet average miles per gallon would be 45 miles to the gallon and the automakers all said that they could do it they agreed to do and then the next we don't have that today. 18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And so the next president comes and rolls it back, but I think that's the instead of the political lesson that was learned by future presidents, it was this idea of avoiding these big ticket issues and avoid doing these right things and it was more political expediency versus doing the right thing regardless of the consequences, but now 40 years later. 18:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We look back at it, and especially as millennials, and I think his presidency will get Rosier and Rosier because it's coming out and it'll continue to come out, but this guy was way ahead of his time. 19:02 [SPEAKER_01]: He was right, and his history books will be very kind to him. 19:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I hope that's the lesson that politicians start to get from Carter is that maybe it's not always about that reelection or maybe there is still room to tackle big issues. 19:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and I think it really, it also comes down to the voters, and you have to say, I don't even know, you have to say, we need to reward leaders who will do things like that, rather than punishing them. 19:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Presidents don't think like that anymore. 19:30 [SPEAKER_00]: None of them do. 19:32 [SPEAKER_00]: The failure to take big political risks on behalf of the American landscape is a bipartisan problem. 19:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Jim brought up a current example of our sitting U.S. President who happens to be of the same political party as Jimmy 19:46 [SPEAKER_01]: even just look at the current president who's been great on conservation even he is at odds currently with president Carter over the road issue in a last and I think jim a little bit more about this than I do, but it's definitely worth mentioning. 20:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So Carter we touched on the Carter preserved over 150 million acres of land in Alaska in what's known as a nilka the 20:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, and he, one of those was a wildlife refuge, it's name is escaping me right now, but I was a wildlife refuge in Alaska that is wilderness and wilderness is the highest level of protection that land can get in the United States. 20:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And it means that you can't do anything to that land. 20:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It has to be left in its natural state. 20:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And basically there's a controversy now where there's a local Native American tribe there that wants to build a road through this wildlife refuge in order to get access to an airport. 20:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And some people are saying that it's vitally needed for safety and some medical things in that nature. 20:53 [SPEAKER_01]: There's also a cannery there that wants the road to be able to ferry their employees back and forth. 20:59 [SPEAKER_01]: So there's some controversy with that. 21:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But the fact of the matter is that the road would go through this wilderness, through this wildlife refuge, and you can't do that. 21:07 [SPEAKER_01]: This was an act of Congress. 21:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And so what happened is under the previous administration, what they did was they 21:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Fish and wildlife will trade the land that you need to build this road for 40,000 acres over here. 21:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And they tried to do that and it was held up in court. 21:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And now for reasons unknown to me, the Biden administration is defending that move in court. 21:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're saying, no, we can swap that land. 21:37 [SPEAKER_01]: and it's very controversial because this was an act of Congress that established this wilderness and you can't have an administration come in and say, we're going to change this based on our whims. 21:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's, and the point that Carter makes, who, as a 97 year old, just filed a brief in court on this issue, which is just impressive in and of itself, the point that he makes is that the way the law was written, the secretary of interior can't just pick and choose how it's interpreted. 22:13 [SPEAKER_01]: The law was written a certain way, and they can't just say, okay, 22:21 [SPEAKER_00]: This may not sound like a big deal. 22:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a massive deal. 22:25 [SPEAKER_00]: This kind of legal precedent could threaten the very existence of the national park system as we know it. 22:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, and so I think it's about the precedent because if you could do that, then what's the stop you from going into your semity valley and saying, oh, well, there's this company that would love to commercialize the valley. 22:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we're gonna trade the land and the valley to them. 22:46 [SPEAKER_01]: and they'll give us some land somewhere else in the searers. 22:50 [SPEAKER_01]: That, it's the same difference that you know, somebody was established by an active congress. 22:55 [SPEAKER_01]: So to say that you can do that, it sets a frankly a terrifying precedent for our public lands that have previously been safeguarded. 23:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So anyway, that's something that's going on right now that a lot of people are talking about, but it could have huge implications. 23:11 [SPEAKER_00]: as they were describing what was happening in Alaska, it occurred to me that I'd heard of something similar happened in Yosemite in the 19th century. 23:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I'd read it on their website actually, but I couldn't remember the name of the controversy. 23:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Hedgehog Hedgehog, yeah, I was going to tell the story of that. 23:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I was going to say it just like that where Hedgehog is part of Yosemite National Park. 23:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to say it was under the Wilson administration. 23:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't remember it. 23:38 [SPEAKER_01]: But I'll check it. 23:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but basically what happened was the city of San Francisco needed a fresh water supply. 23:45 [SPEAKER_01]: They were running out of the where they were currently getting their water from. 23:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And it was, yeah, there were places where they could have gotten water that were going to would have cost a lot more money, but they could have done it. 23:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But they really wanted to dam the Hetch Hetchy Valley in Yosemite and make it a reservoir and that give them the fresh water, and just to set the stage for what Hetch Hetchy looked like. 24:15 [SPEAKER_01]: It is almost in a replica of Yosemite Valley. 24:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Just imagine today if they put a damn Yosemite Valley, John Mureb said it was of equal scene 24:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And so John Murr is out in front of saying that this place is a cathedral. 24:33 [SPEAKER_01]: It's absolutely incredible you can't do this. 24:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And they ended up what they did was the city of San Francisco. 24:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I believe their former either mayor or anyway was now very influential cabinet member in the Wilson administration. 24:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they managed to convince the Wilson administration to 24:55 [SPEAKER_01]: give them the go ahead and they were actually able to damn in a national park which is it's frankly it's an illegal act you can't do that because it was preserved by Congress. 25:08 [SPEAKER_01]: They found a way around it and that set a very chilling precedent which has never been done since. 25:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Before the end of the conversation, I want to ask for some practical advice on visiting the parks. 25:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Because most of the major ones are out west, I asked the brothers if there were any national parks in the eastern half of the country that might function as something of a poor man's yosemity or Yellowstone. 25:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, they're not even, they're not even foreman, Sierra Jimmel, T up here, and you can, well, so first of all, Great Smokey Mountain's National Park. 25:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say, if you're living in the Eastern United States, there are very few places in the Eastern United States where you can see the land the way it was when Europeans first got here. 25:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And great smokey mountains is one of those places. 25:58 [SPEAKER_01]: There are still old growth trees there, old growth forest intact. 26:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I think FDR, when he dedicated the park, he had a great line, he said there are Brooks still running here. 26:10 [SPEAKER_01]: that the pioneers cut their hands and drank from when they first got here and there are trees here that are older than our forefathers and so forth and so great smoke amounts is certainly a place that has the grandeur and it has I couldn't recommend it more. 26:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It is the most visited national park in the countries so I 26:31 [SPEAKER_01]: 10 million people visit the great smoking mountains every single year. 26:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say if you're planning on going obviously trying to void the weekend and if you can avoid the summer, but except to think and I would like you to go in the fall. 26:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought Jim was going to go a different direction for this one, especially in the mid-west, you have in Minnesota, but the National Park of Jim and I both think is the most underrated national park in America, which is Voyager's National Park, just a few things. 27:05 [SPEAKER_01]: For one, people think you have to go to either Iceland or Alaska to see the Northern Lights. 27:10 [SPEAKER_01]: the best displays of northern lights in the continental US and some of the best in the world happen in voyagers on a regular basis. 27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: If the sun sets in that park are unlike any you will see in any park because it's so water based that it's you're getting, you're always getting two sun sets you're getting the sun set and the sun set off of the water and it is just magical. 27:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoyed that will and I can speak from a position of authority on things like sunsets because I can say that the best sunsets I've ever seen are in Voyager's National Park. 27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's my job to photograph amazing sunsets all the time. 27:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And I've seen amazing ones all over the country. 27:55 [SPEAKER_01]: but Voyager's National Park just dollar for dollar every single time. 28:01 [SPEAKER_01]: When you've got some nice clouds going and the water is calm those the waters on those huge lakes just oftentimes can just be glassy and you get this beautiful mirrored sunset that's just like it's like nothing you've seen and the park is just it's a very unique park because it's almost all water-based and so you 28:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Which, yeah, inexpensive during, even you can rent a house, but you can rent on tunes, you can rent kayaks, the whole deal. 28:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And the cool thing, as Jim is probably about to say, is that there are no campgrounds, there are only camp sites, and every campsite is designed so that you cannot see one campsite from another. 28:42 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's the ultimate park for solitude and experiences nature. 28:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Not to mention, Bald Eagle's Beaver's Moose Wolves. 28:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's a really special place that has just the ability to get out there and have that solitude and as well as saying that the campsites, but it's not most national parks, you go to a campground, it's like, okay, you expect here the were of generators and RVs and kids riding their bikes and so forth and some of that can be kind of calming in a sense, because it's like, yeah, I'm back in a campground, this is what it's like, but 29:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Envoyagers, they're all completely unto themselves, some of them are on their own islands, and it's a special place, and definitely the most underrated national park. 29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And I would chip in two more quickly. 29:30 [SPEAKER_01]: One is Samara, we're actually launching our latest film on Badlands National Park. 29:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I discovered the park once before, but we felt like we didn't do it quite justices, so we're back and actually working with the state of South Dakota. 29:43 [SPEAKER_01]: this is it's going to be a really beautiful film you can see it on our website more than this park's dot com but it's the badlands if you're willing to go a little bit further from that Minnesota Midwest area epic epic national park with bison it's the i guess probably the first park heading west where there are bison their pure bison from a lot of the bison we have today are 30:07 [SPEAKER_01]: what you know are commonly referred to as people of these are not these are the ones that are Native Americans and people have seen for a long time that's a great one and then also I would say in the Colorado Utah area great sand dunes national park a very little less servicited park that is just imagine the 30:30 [SPEAKER_01]: foreground is something that looks like our desert to an American with the backdrop of the rocky mountains. 30:37 [SPEAKER_01]: It is an unbelievable place and like you feel like you're in the desert in these dunes, but you look up in there the Rocky Mountains. 30:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Within a day you can experience the desert and also a beautiful alpine scenery. 30:51 [SPEAKER_01]: You go catch a trout and then go sandboarding. 30:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's a otherworldly place that is one of the most beautiful places in American. 30:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I also will and I did theater Roosevelt National Park, no, yeah, Dakota and that one I was just shocked by a lot of people think of North Dakota and the thing that comes to mind is the movie Fargo and that's just that's the way it is, I guess, but I'll tell you what. 31:13 [SPEAKER_01]: you go out to Medora, which is where it is. 31:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And the park is set. 31:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's where a theater arose about lived for a time. 31:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's where he discovered this love of those landscapes. 31:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And they actually preserve his his old cabin is there. 31:27 [SPEAKER_01]: You shouldn't go and visit that. 31:29 [SPEAKER_01]: But 31:29 [SPEAKER_01]: the landscapes are just gigantic. 31:32 [SPEAKER_01]: You have bison and I was blown away and will and I we did a back country hike. 31:36 [SPEAKER_01]: They have petrified forests. 31:40 [SPEAKER_01]: We've been to petrified forest national park in Arizona and not to take anything away from that, but I'll tell you what. 31:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Deodore Roosevelt National Park has the most incredible petrified forest remnants I have ever seen. 31:55 [SPEAKER_01]: They have giant dumps from like prehistoric cypress trees that are like like huge, they're gigantic and they're completely preserved and they're just totally petrified. 32:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I've never seen them so intact like that and they're everywhere all over this there's a 32:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Over the course of the last year, I'd heard from a number of people who had attempted to visit a park without a reservation and had been turned away. 32:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Before hearing that, I had no idea reservations were even necessary. 32:28 [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of that's very new. 32:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Those these timed entry systems and reservations and things. 32:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and when we started doing what we're doing, we would roll up into national parks any time a day. 32:38 [SPEAKER_01]: We'd roll up into the campgrounds and we'd get a campsite and never 32:43 [SPEAKER_01]: and now you could never do that. 32:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And it just in the last 10 years the amount of change that our parks have undergone because of visitation which is it's great that people are wanting to visit these places but I think another thing is we talked about the fact that the parks have just these billions of dollars of deferred maintenance and some of that is because they need more campgrounds or they need to 33:04 [SPEAKER_01]: develop some other opportunities for people to disperse a little more or things like that. 33:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And so that can be a real issue now. 33:13 [SPEAKER_01]: But I would say I think some people might listen to this and say, well, hang on. 33:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, you guys make these films about the national parks and a lot of this stuff make some look pretty good. 33:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So aren't you guys part of the problem? 33:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And to that... 33:26 [SPEAKER_01]: point, Gemini's whole thing is we think that greater awareness of these places ultimately leads to greater protection. 33:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we think it's important for you to go and have amazing experience in these national parks because then when you come back home you tell your friends people know about how amazing they are. 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: If ever some of these natural places come into any kind of 33:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you know your friends know everybody knows that know that there is will never be a chance There there will be an oil well in the assembly or a gold mine in Zion or different things like this because the more people that know about these places is a better overcrowding is a casualty of that 34:11 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think as Americans were falling back in love with an national park, especially enhanced by COVID, I think this is an issue that will eventually sort itself out in time, but I'll tell you what overcrowding sure beats in alternative of extraction and exploitation. 34:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, and there's a term that a lot of people in the industry will talk about are parks being loved to death, and they'll say that, but I'd so much rather have people love the parks than less people love the parks and because if you love these places, you have a respect for them and you don't want anything bad to happen to them. 34:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, there will be some overcrowding and things that can come with that. 34:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But more than that, it's just about people care about these places. 34:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And when the park service says, hey, you know what? 35:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Because so many people are visiting, we need to do time denture. 35:05 [SPEAKER_01]: We need to do this. 35:06 [SPEAKER_01]: You're okay with that because you care about the place and you want what's best for these places and I think that's really it Is the more people who want what's best for our national parks the more people with a vested interest in our national parks the better off They are in the long run 35:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Will and Jim will be back with us for an episode on the CCC in the coming weeks. 35:29 [SPEAKER_00]: In the meantime, I couldn't recommend their website more highly. 35:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called more than just parks and more than just parks.com. 35:37 [SPEAKER_00]: And even if you can't make it to the parks in person, they have articles and videos that will get you as close as possible without actually making the trip.
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